Why won't the Jets listen?


Most NFL experts, besides Favre lovers have been watching this happen for years. Why couldn’t Woody and Tannenbaum see it? Here’s a article from Sal Paolantonio from last March, before the Jets made the mistake.

Overhyped: Favre didn’t deliver in second half of career

Paolantonio By Sal Paolantonio
ESPN.com
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Brett FavreScott Boehm/Getty Images
In the playoffs, Brett Favre was 3-5 with 14 touchdown passes and 16 interceptions.

We interrupt the continued deification of Brett Favre — a first-ballot Hall of Famer and the most durable player in NFL history — with the following reality check.

Yes, Favre played long enough to throw the most touchdown passes and collect the most wins by an NFL quarterback. But let’s examine the second half of No. 4′s career. The truth is, Favre did little over the past decade to earn the gushing praise heaped upon him by our fawning brethren in the media.

Best-Ever Debate

 

In his 17 seasons, Brett Favre set numerous NFL records, including most yards passing (61,655) and most touchdowns (442). But do those numbers, combined with Favre’s three MVP awards and one Super Bowl victory, put him among the top 10 quarterbacks of all time?  

Recently, ESPN.com’s Mike Sando and Football Outsiders’ Aaron Schatz examined the best-ever debate.

•  Sando | Football Outsiders

After beating the San Francisco 49ers in the 1997 NFC Championship Game, Favre won just three of his last 10 playoff games. Eli Manning had more postseason wins in a 29-day span this past season than Favre had in his last decade with the Green Bay Packers.

Yes, Favre won a Super Bowl — 11 years ago! But as his career arc spiraled downward, the blind adulation only got worse.  

Favre’s passer rating in his last 12 postseason games was a pedestrian 77.8. In his last five wild-card games, he went 2-3 with more interceptions (nine) than touchdown passes (seven). In his last three divisional playoff games, he went 1-2 with seven TDs and seven interceptions. That’s a 3-5 record with 14 touchdown passes and 16 picks.

In two of his last four postseason appearances, Favre threw two of the most unthinkable playoff interceptions in NFL history, both in overtime — to Brian Dawkins of the Philadelphia Eagles in 2003 and to Corey Webster of the New York Giants in January. In fact, Favre is the only quarterback in NFL history to throw overtime interceptions in two playoff games. In his last nine playoff games, Favre threw 18 interceptions.

 

Malcolm Emmons/US PresswireBrett Favre’s career playoff record was 12-10. Fellow Packer star quarterback Bart Starr, above, was 9-1.

In the first 81 years of the Green Bay franchise, the most hallowed in all of pro football, the Packers were 13-0 at home in the postseason. But since 2002, the Packers have gone 2-3 in playoff games at Lambeau Field, with Favre losing to three not-quite Hall of Fame quarterbacks: Michael Vick, Daunte Culpepper and Manning.

If Manning had a decade like that, he’d be run out of New York. If Philip Rivers kept chucking ridiculous overtime interceptions in the postseason, he would be branded a first-round bust. If Drew Brees came up short in three out of five home playoff games, he’d be mocked.

But no matter how many dumb passes he threw and how many playoff games he lost, Favre remains immune to criticism.

Favre isn’t even the greatest quarterback in the history of the Packers. It’s not even close. Bart Starr won five NFL championships — four more than Favre — and retired as the NFL’s most accurate passer.

Oh, you say Starr was surrounded by a Hall of Fame roster with a legendary coach. But Starr still is the NFL record holder with a 104.8 career playoff passer rating, nearly 20 points higher than Favre’s. That wasn’t Vince Lombardi or Ray Nitschke throwing those passes for Starr, whose career postseason passer rating, by the way, is 38 points higher than Johnny Unitas’.

Favre’s career playoff record was 12-10. Starr’s was 9-1 — without the benefit of wild-card games. Favre threw 28 interceptions in 22 playoff games. Starr threw three in 10. Think about that — just three picks in 213 postseason attempts.

But Bart Starr gets the Ringo Starr treatment — underappreciated and overlooked. Favre gets put on a pedestal. Yes, he had a Pro Bowl season in 2007 with the youngest roster in the NFL. But his final moment on Lambeau Field was a wildly errant pass that turned into the NFC title for the Giants.

Indeed, a decade after his last moments of glory, the football hype machine continues to paint Favre as a hallowed icon of Americana, a symbol of all that is right with sports, a Wild West gun-slinging good ol’ boy. There’s Brett on the farm! There’s Brett with his family! There’s Brett on the cover of Sports Illustrated! There’s Brett throwing another overtime interception!

Favre was among the best in the game, once upon a time. Those days are long gone. Only the idolatry remains.

This is adapted from the best-selling book “The Paolantonio Report: The Most Overrated and Underrated Players, Teams, Coaches and Moments in NFL History” by Sal Paolantonio with Reuben Frank, which is available in local bookstores and at Amazon.com.

THE JETS ONLY OPTION IS TO CUT THEIR LOSSES AND ALLOW SCHOTTENHEIMER TO DEVELOP ONE OF THE KIDS… FAVRE ISN’T GETTING YOUNGER, AND REFUSES TO CHANGE HIS GAME.

ELWAY WAS A GUNSLINGER THAT FINALLY ACCEPTED THE FACT THAT GUNSLINGING WON’T WORK… THAT’S HOW HE WON LATE IN HIS CAREER BY ALLOWING THE RUNNING GAME AND DEFENSE TO HELP HIM TO THE PROMISE LAND. SAME THING HAPPENED FOR PEYTON MANNING IN HIS SUPERBOWL RUN… FAVRE JUST DOESN’T GET IT AND NEEDS TO LEAVE BEFORE THIS GETS MORE EMBARRASING. MOVE ON MAN, KEEP YOUR LEGACY INTACT! MOST PEOPLE DON’T REALIZE THIS STUFF YET, BUT ANOTHER YEAR OF THIS PLAY WILL START TO DRAW MUCH MORE TALK. WE APPRECIATE THE TRY, NOW IT’S TIME TO LET IT GO…

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Tags: Favre Interceptions Sal Paolantonio Super Bowl Tannenbaum Woody Johnson

  • Mike H

    Minnesota Mike says: Please release him and let us have him.

  • Mike H

    Why did the Packers and now the Jets want Favre to retire?  Do they think if he was released he would do something for the team that he wants to play for?

  • hal

    You’re just putting up a cut and paste of the Favre haters. Go find the article by Jemille Hill on Favre. You’d like it. Its the same regurgitation of cherry picked statistics to fulfill your emotional needs. The problem is that it was the year before he led the Packers to a 13-3 season while playing like an MVP.

    Let’s hear your breakdown of the offensive play calling by the Jets. Lets hear your evaluation of the receivers ability to get open. Lets hear your evaluation of the ability of the receivers to compete for the ball. Lets hear the statistics on how well (or poorly) the O-line protected the QB. Those are relevant to an overall evaluation but they can’t happen because the attack on Favre is based on the emotional needs of the haters.

  • Jim

    These Favre – hating – reporter types don’t get one thing…you don’t speak for us the fans…you think you do, but you don’t.

    We like watching Brett play, we KNOW he is a legend and a Hall of Famer and we know that it is easy to sell your article if it is negative.

    We think You all SUCK…lets see your stats!

    Brett is a people’s champion and we measure by the heart and will to play…love of the game.

    I know many players with good stats that I would NEVER want to meet or see play, stats do not measure a man…

    (I wish I could meet all these reporter types to bash a few pencil necked heads)

  • Brad Cotter

    You want to talk about the Offensive Line? OK, how about Thomas Jones leading the AFC in rushing and while averaging less than 25 touches a game… Matter of fact, when he did touch the ball 25 times, the Jets were undefeated.

    You want to talk about Favre’s success last year… You can point to two Facts… Ryan Grant & the NFC North. Last year was the first time Favre completed an offseason training program in a decade, and yes, he played well.

    Too bad the rest of the years, he refuses to do the work, which is why he has struggled.

    Let’s look at Hal’s point… Here’s my breakdown of the offensive play calling… Schottenheimer was a run first, conservative play caller for the first half of the year… Jets 8-3…

    Favre goes to Schottenheimer and told him they need to open things up and play more 5 wide and Shotgun… Jets fall apart.

    The receivers didn’t fight for the ball? Are you kidding? The Jets receivers are among the toughest in the league… Is it a coincidence Coles thought this was a terrible move from Day 1? If you guys would take a minute to watch game film, you would see loads of open receivers all year. The problem is your beloved Favre has had to rely on his arm his whole career instead of preperation. It’s hard to get open when you’re double teamed and the checkdown is wide open.

    As far as the protection, that’s easy. The line was protecting him the first half of the year when they were running the ball. When they decided to start throwing 35 times a game is when the opponents could start teeing off on Favre.

    Answer this, why would the Jets throw the ball all game in Seattle in the snow? Do you think that’s the way Mangini wanted to go into this game, or the way Favre believed they could win?

    Jim, we know you like watching Favre play… I like watching Michael Vick play too… Both athletic freaks… they just both lack the drive to do the smart things to win ball games…

    Also, you want to measure you’re QB by heart? If that’s the case, then I’m sure you would much rather have Pennington back. He worked way harder than Favre and was way more selfless…

    I’m sure you love the fact that Favre said before he landed with the Jets that “he wouldn’t play for the Jets, because he wanted a chance to win”.

    I’m also sure you loved the fact that he came into training camp late and instead of being selfless and learning the Jets offense, he wanted to make the other 10 guys on offense learn plays he feels comfortable with… What a great guy! A fantastic leader! Pennington learned the Miami playbook in 2 weeks, but people still make excuses for Favre not learning the Jets playbook by week 17…

    You’re right though! He has good commercials, and wears Wranglers.

    Here’s the deal. I don’t hate the person. Brett seems like a nice guy. I just think he is extremely selfish as a player and doesn’t work hard. Don’t get me wrong, he gives 110% on Sundays, but that’s not what makes a champion. Monday through Saturday is what makes it happen, and Favre has said for years he just doesn’t want to do it.

    He doesn’t want to hang with the guys or “manage” the game. If he’s not the focal point, he doesn’t want to be in there. People’s Champ… maybe… Football Champ…? Not the way he’s been playing for the last decade.

    As far as his last year with Green Bay, 13-3 and to the NFC Championship game… A Packer legend right? Then why did they trade him? If he’s the guy you all are talking about, why would they let him go for Aaron Rodgers… an upproven guy… The reason is he is uncoachable and they didn’t want their young roster to think that was acceptable.

    And Jim, you want to see my stats? That’s funny… I’d show ‘em to you if I made $12 Million dollars to lead the league in INT’s. My stats are the same as yours buddy…

    You can continue to suck the teet of what the NFL has been trying to spoon feed you for years, or you can appreciate him for the truth.

    He was an amazingly entertaining QB. He’ll continue to sell Jersey’s if he stays… that’s about it.

    Mike H… You’re right, if he went to another team, it would be the same crap… Lots of hype and excitement and when the game means something, we know what happens.

    I wish I could say different… I just want the Jets to have a chance to win. Last year Pennington gave them the best chance. This year, they’d be better off developing someone else than going through another year of this publicity stunt.

    I’m surprised guys like Jim have more loyalty to a career Packer than his own team. Thomas Jones already said what everyone was thinking and you’re going to take Favre’s side? Great fan you are!

    I guarantee you this, Jim, when Favre decides to hang them up, he will thank the Jets for their time and effort. He’ll say it just never felt right and he’ll always be a Packer.

    You’re rooting for a guy who wore Packers yellow shoulder pads under OUR Green jersey… Do you think any proud franchise, Steelers, Giants, Cowboys, etc… would ever allow a player (regardless of who he is) to wear another teams colors?

    I think not.

    Either way, I’m glad you guys are at least passionate about this situation. I do respect your views, even though I disagree… This kind of passion is what will hopefully get this team where it needs to go. We all want the same thing, and that’s a success franchise we can be proud of. We can argue about how to get there until next season… That’s the beauty of this country!

  • Brad Cotter

    A few misspelled words in that post… but you guys get the drift.

  • Brad Cotter

    Oh, and by the way… in 1996, when Brett won his only Superbowl… he did so with one of the best defenses ever!

    1996 Green Bay Packers & 2002 Bucs were the only two teams to ever lead the NFL regular season in total yards, passing yards and points allowed.

    This years Pittsburgh Steelers are the 3rd…

    Just some food for thought.

  • baz

    Trading for Favre had nothing to do with winning, as you can plainly see by posts here.  So many just care about image & spin, rather than reality.  Jim (above) likes seeing Favre play… if he’s a Jets fan, he doesn’t care much about winning.
    And unfortunately, too many people think like Jim… hence, Woody did what he needed to do.  Why worry about winning, when fans don’t care?
    Woody said he wanted to change direction, so he fired Mangini, yet kept Schott & Sutton??  As long as the Media spin it as Woody wants them to, all’s cool in Jetsland.  How many fans wanted Schott back, even though the O has been in the bottom half of the league, for Schott’s three seasons.
    Unless the fans demand better, we’ll never win a championship… but at least we’ll have over-the-hill legends, and incompetent coaches the media likes.  And the fans will be happy.

  • Brad Cotter

    Well said brotha!  

  • Wayne Lewis

    Twenty five years of season ticket holding watching this pathetic mess. Now it has become the same old, same old.  We were headed in the right direction with Tannebaum and Mangini.  Then, Tannebaum lost his mind and acquired a has been.  Everything we were building was sacrificed for selling PSL’s in the new stadium.
    Tannebaum should have been fired for this mistake.  Brett Favre has become a Terrell Owens,  Keyshawn Johnson,  Stephon Marbury type.  Certainly not in a villanous, loud way,  but in the me first, poor teammate kind of way.  We don’t need this indecision crap.  We don’t need his lack of practice and dedication routine.  We don’t need his sore arm.  Eric Mangini saw it.  Eric stood on the sidelines hogtied by management.  I’d bet money he wanted to replace Favre in the last 3 games and was denied by management.
    Now we have all kinds of coaching and philosophy changes, creating  more chaos.  As the real boss, BRUCE,  would say, we are on the DOWNBOUND TRAIN.

  • jeff ircink

    brad -

    you forgot a couple things. the Jets’ receivers are good – but did that reflect the season they had individually? Jets’ D had 28 sacks in the first 8 games and 12 in the last 8. Jets’ D ranked 4th worst in allowing passing yards per game and for the season. play calling by Mangini – disliked it even when the Jets were 8-3. O-line protection of Favre – average at best.

  • iowachick

    There’s a lot of old news in this article. Today (2-1-09) Mangold completely contradicted TJ about the atmosphere in the locker room. He felt there was great chemistry with Favre and they appreciated he just wanted to be treated as “one of the guys.” Favre played as a great “game manager” through the Titans win. How do you know he wanted the other 11 to play his way? He had very little time to absorb the play book and did better when it was simplified. Don’t forget the Jets had a winning season. However, Brett was sacked far more than he was used to. And when he started throwing badly, tell me–were there 10 other players playing great? No, the whole team collapsed. Kris Jenkins was struggling and admitted it. Ever think TJ had his great Season BECAUSE of Favre? Defense was busy going after Favre and had to create hole in the D lines.

    Anyway, I am sick of crap articles like this. The Jets were not a good match from the start and that is exactly why the Packers traded him there. They sure did not want him to succeed and I think he did damn good for the situation.

    Even the NFL has stated that without Brett Favre and the fans interested in him, revenues are down. If Woody got him to sell seats, it worked. Do you think people buy so many Jersey’s because they can’t stand him???

    I hope Brett does not come back–especially to the Jets. He doesn’t need all this crap bull when even a nine year player like TJ can diss on him in public and writers extrapolate it to the whole lockeroom. Coles was unhappy early because he was Chad’s friend. Later he said, “Brett Favre is a true legend and he has done a lot more for my career that I have done for his.”

    I do hope Brett is someplace we can see him. Sundays won’t be the same without Brett and those wonderful will he or won’t he passes. He needs at team that has an offensive line that can protect him, and runners who can catch, instead of having balls bounce off their numbers. Oh, and it would be good if he did not have teammates that foul so his TD’s are called back. Affects his stats more than anybody’s.

    You can just bury the rest of your remarks in the backyard.

  • http://www.uwlax.edu/esl/staff/PatrickRandolph.htm Patrick T. Ranbdolph

    Brett is the best gridiron player I have ever seen. To go 17 years without missing a game is truly phenomenal. We loved to watch him play. Even his interceptions are exciting, beautiful and full of passion for the game. Brett is a true humanitarian on and off the field. My personal opinion is that the JETS did not deserve him. It was mind boggling to watch him through 6 touchdowns against the Cardinals and see the stadium half empty. Bring him back to the Midwest where football is our religion. We’d love to see him play for the Vikings!

  • http://Greenfloorrecords.com Scott Thompson

    Winning playoff games is a team effort.  Favre has only been on a couple teams with the “total package”  

    You Judge an individual player based on numbers … yes wins are one of them but you really have to look at the big picture.

    Your report really failed to provide me with any “Aha!”  moments. 

    Cut the guy a break.

  • http://Greenfloorrecords.com Scott Thompson

    by the way  Bart Starr’s Career INT Percentage was 4.4% and Favre’s is/was 4.2   

    Favre has thrown 440+ TD’s    Star 120 something…  

    Bart Starr had  better teams/Lombardi…  

    I mean the  comparison is weak at best. . 

  • Brad Cotter

    Wayne, couldn’t agree with you more… My family had season tickets until their move to Florida, but I still know a bunch of guys that go every Sunday for 20+ years. The last thing we need is a guy who is wearing Packers colors under our Jersey. The only way this team will ever earn some respect is to demand a commitment to this organization from each of their players… regardless of their last name… and yes, Tannenbaum should’ve been out, and Shannahan should’ve been in… but Ryan is a strong candidate and I’ll give the dude a chance! Love the Boss reference too!!! My wife’s a “Jersey Girl” so I gotta give Bruce his love!!!

    Jeff- I definitely agree that the defense fell off in the second half of the season. In my opinion this is directly related to Time of Possession. The beginning of the year, the Jets were running the ball and allowing the defense to rest (most importantly Kris Jenkins) but in the second half of the year, this became a throw first team. That will hurt the defense every time. Look at what makes a good defensive squad… It’s a good running game and a quarterback that doesn’t put them in bad position.

    IowaChick- I know it’s hard to accept the truth. It’s very hard to look at a guy who you root for and accept the truth that they just don’t have it anymore. Unfortuntatley, when you really look at the numbers, and the way Brett has held Green Bay hostage for the past 5 years it’s funny you feel this way. When it comes to our favorite guys, we turn a blind eye to the truth. I understand. Unfortunately, this is not a new thing I’m saying. I’ve been talking about this for the last 5 years. Brett Favre sells, because the NFL markets him too… not cause he’s the best QB. Unfortunately, if he does this crap in NY, we’ll call him on it. He was able to hide in Wisconsin for the last decade with fans like yourself that will just give him a pass, because those INT’s are so exciting… LOL!!!

    Patrick- please bro, I beg of you not to ever call an interception “exciting, beautiful and full of passion for the game”

    That’s like telling your kids that they don’t need to study all week for a test on Friday, as long as when they take that test that they do it with passion. They used to study and were the top of the class, but instead now they wing it on test day and fail with passion…??? Yup, very respectable.

    Scott- You’re right… it’s a team game… but unfortunately in this league, you have guys making lots of money that are brought in for specific reasons.  BELIEVE ME, if Favre would’ve come into this team and managed this team to the best of his abilities without leading the league in PICK’s… ARE YOU GUYS PAYING ATTENTION? THIS GUY YOU’RE DEFENDING LED THE NFL IN INT’S, AND HAS DONE THAT MULTIPLE TIMES IN HIS CAREER!!!

    THE BOTTOM LINE IS THAT YOU ALL KNOW IN YOUR HEARTS THAT SOMEONE WITH HIS STATS @ 39 YEARS OLD WOULD’VE BEEN RAN OUTTA TOWN A LONG TIME AGO… BESIDES THE FACT WOODY WANTED TO SELL JERSEYS AND SELL PSL’S. THAT’S THE TRUTH.

    NY Fans, especially Jets fans are some of the most intelligent in the league. That’s why guys like Wayne and baz know the real deal. For a new stadium, this was the right thing for the franchise financially. But we all know, that’s about it. This wasn’t the best move to win ball games.

    The Jets O-line had struggled two years ago… The Jets brought in the beef with Faneca, Woody, Tony Richardson, Jenkins, Pace, etc… to turn this into a run first defensive team… You can all say what you want about Favre, but this team is better off without him. I appreciate what he’s done for this league, but his time has passed. Those QB’s who have come into the league after his mold are struggling.

    The bottom line is if he was the best option for Green Bay, they would’ve kept him. He is turning into a pre-madonna, and that just won’t work for me. Us Jets fans need to demand more!!!

  • Brad Cotter

    By beef, I meant lines…. not just the O-line obviously…

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